10-weeks-abortion

Abortion supporter calls pictures of aborted babies “dead bodies,” reveals knowledge that abortion kills

My pro-life website has quotes from abortionists and pictures of aborted babies. On the pages with the pictures of aborted babies, I have a brief survey which allows a visitor to answer several questions and leave their own comments. I got a comment this morning that I thought was interesting, and I wanted to share it.

The comment comes from a 37-year-old woman who claims to be an “atheist/agnostic.” She says:

“quit with the lies and half truths. the set up of the pics are disgusting. seriously, would it be okay to play with and pose any other kinds of dead bodies? war is horrible but you don’t see people making horrific scenarios with peoples [sic] body parts.”

Of course, she does not mention what any of the “lies and half-truths” are, or offer to refute them. But the part that I found interesting was the part that said “would it be okay to play with and pose any other kinds of dead bodies?”

10-weeks-abortion

When she says “play with and pose” I believe she was referring to the pictures of aborted babies from the Center for Bio Ethical Reform. These pictures show pieces of aborted babies placed next to or on top of coins. This is done, I believe, to show the size of the aborted babies. Because the sizes are clearly displayed, the ages of the babies can be verified a little more easily. There are tables in embryology textbooks that show how big a developing embryo is at each stage of development.

What I find most revealing about this woman’s comment is the part that says “any other kind of dead bodies.” She freely admits that the pictures show “dead bodies.” Pro-choicers often identify unborn babies as “fetal tissue”or “fetal material.” Former clinic workers such as Abby Johnson have said that the most common way abortion providers refer to aborted babies is “products of conception.” What an evasive and sanitized term!

Yet this prochoicer freely acknowledges what I believe most people know deep down – that pictures of aborted babies are in fact pictures of dead bodies. The pictures show the dead bodies of children, not medical waste. Even more telling is the use of the term “people” to describe the aborted children.

Abortion is not the simple removal of “products of conception” Abortion kills people. And this abortion advocate knows it.

This website visitor’s comments are an example of what seems to be a growing trend among abortion advocates- admitting the humanity of unborn children but using arguments such as bodily autonomy to argue in favor of legally killing those children. I wrote an article some time ago quoting pro-choice activists, some of them very prominent, saying that abortion is equivalent to taking a life. Since I wrote that article, I have found other statements from pro-choicers to the same effect.

Pro-lifers are winning the battle to convince people that unborn babies are people. We must now turn towards the task of convincing people that killing these people is never justified.

  • PrincessJasmine4

    Anti-lifers are now accusing us of using pictures of stillborn babies and not those of real aborted babies on our websites.
    Thoughts?

    • sarah5775

      I’ve heard that said a number of times. I used to point out that babies are not stillborn with their arms and legs ripped off and their skulls crushed. that usually shuts them up

      • PrincessJasmine4

        They push this picture of what an abortion looks like at 5-6 weeks

        http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lsk6qdfmwV1qi68z9.jpg

        thoughts?

        • Basset_Hound

          They didn’t get the camera close enough to the top half of the pie pan.

        • sarah5775

          No way

          • sarah5775

            I don’t think so, but maybeyou should ask Abby Johnson or another ex abortion clinic worker

          • sarah5775

            can you tell me what page thsi was from?

          • PrincessJasmine4
          • PrincessJasmine4

            That’s my reaction too
            There’s a site though called my abortion dot com
            The chick is trying to prove that it’s really nothing

            When presented w this picture I told the pro abort that the picture wasn’t a real representation

            We went back and forth for a long time

          • sarah5775

            I’m going to write an article on this.

          • PrincessJasmine4

            I was hoping you were gonna say that :-)
            There’s a few other things if like to pick your brain about if that’s ok
            Is there any other way of contacting you?

          • Acyutananda

            Hi. You asked for thoughts. My thought is that it’s not a good idea for pro-lifers to make
            the stage of development an important issue. Making it an important
            issue implies that if a particular aborted baby had been less developed, then the abortion would have been more okay; and then the day before that it would have
            been even more okay, etc.; so that if the abortion had been done very
            early, it would have been completely okay.

            The most important thing is not whether an abortion was gruesome or even if the baby felt pain.
            What is important is that the baby was deprived of its life. If it was
            killed earlier, it was deprived of even MORE of its life than if it had
            been killed later. If it’s killed at 7 mos., at least the parents let it
            live for 7 mos. — we could look at it that way. I don’t think we should suggest that the abortion of a less-developed baby is preferable.

          • PrincessJasmine4

            Good point.

          • Adam Peters

            I agree that the right to life doesn’t hinge on how developed one is (an infant, for example, is no less of a person than a teenager).

            However, I also think that it’s legitimate to point out that late term abortions are particularly painful, gruesome acts. In our legal system, we recognize when a crime has aggravating factors (murder combined with torture, for example), and we punish those aggravations more harshly. I think it’s fair to recognize those facts when discussing abortion as well.

          • Acyutananda

            Thanks. I had said, “. . . it’s not a good idea . . . to make the stage of development an IMPORTANT issue.”

            Gruesomeness per se will make an abortion more abhorrent for the post-natal people who are aware of it. But per se it doesn’t make any difference to the baby, and I don’t think we should make our own suffering (feelings of shock) an issue.

            Pain is certainly an issue, so there you and I might differ, if at all, only on what is “an important issue.” Pain is important, but what I meant was that pro-lifers sometimes focus on pain (or on whether the unborn has hands and feet, or a heartbeat, etc.) to the extent that we really send the message “If there’s no pain (or recognizable human features) we won’t object much.” This, I think, is not a good idea.

            This discussion started in relation to the question whether some remains on a plate, as in the image linked to above, really represented an unborn baby at 5-6 weeks. If the issue is only whether some pro-choicers are lying, that issue is okay to raise. But if the issue is whether an abortion at 5-6 weeks is more acceptable if the image is correct, and less acceptable if the image is incorrect, I don’t think we should make that an issue (unless we can make it completely clear that that is not the main issue, which may be difficult); so in cases where we ourselves don’t think there is pain, I think better not to make it an issue at all.

          • sarah5775

            Look me up on facebook. Sarah Terzo. Send me a message. I’ll look for it.

          • PrincessJasmine4

            I’m not on FB :-(

          • sarah5775

            I’m not sure if I should post my personal email or information on here.

          • PrincessJasmine4

            You’re right.
            Don’t
            I will find you some how ;-)

          • MamaBear

            Jasmine, get with a friend who has FB, ask to use it for a private message. Be sure and identify yourself in the private message to Sarah as it will automatically come up with your friend’s name. Private messages are only seen by the person sent and the person receiving.

          • PrincessJasmine4
          • MamBear

            Read the article. I am naturally suspicious of “facts” from Guttmacher and WHO. Longer it went, the weirder it became until it was pushing the pill as a way to save zygotes, if I understood her.
            Then I looked at a few of her other articles. Full of making it look like home-schoolers push teen marriage (one example) and Christians beating their children (again all based on one person I had never heard of rather than the typical family experts most evangelicals like). She is not writing as a neutral party. She has a clear anti-Christian/anti-Evangelical agenda.
            As my statistic professor said, you can make statistics prove anything as long as you control the questions.

          • DianaG2

            WTG, Princess.

            I’m scared to read it right now. They’re so scary and dangerous.

        • DianaG2

          Where is that from?

        • DianaG2

          That’s ridiculous. Where’s all the lining?

        • Ingrid Heimark

          I don’t believe that image is real at all, in every abortion there is a lot of blood, there was no blood there. None the less, even if an early abortion doesn’t look like it killed a human, it did, if the baby doesn’t look “human”, she looks exactly what she is supposed to look like at that stage of development

    • DianaG2

      Yes, I’ve actually read that.

      No thoughts, though. Except, it’s sickening.

    • Ingrid Heimark

      Here in Norway, when pictures are used, the response is “It is not done this way in Norway”, as if that mattered at all, a dead baby is a dead baby, no matter the position or number of pieces

      • PrincessJasmine4

        Do they counter with picture of how it is done in Norway?

        The abortion rate there is relatively low, no?

        And yes, you’re right… a dead baby is a dead baby.

        • Ingrid Heimark

          Well, we have about 55 000 births, and 15 000 abortions every year, all are free. It is almost funny if it wasn’t tragic, it is cheaper for the woman with an abortion than contraception. We have abortion on demand in the first trimester, and then you have to apply, but almost all get approved. The upper limit is viability, placed at 21.6 weeks after about 10 babies were born after abortion and left to die in our hospitals. I think it is cruel. The hospital were I work do abortions, all abortions are done in public hospitals, and I looked at the procedures in the electronic system, abortion after 12 weeks are induction abortion only, and those babies left to die were alive for up to 90 minutes. Noone was charged, even though the abortion comission who approved the abortions knew they were stretching the law.

          I don’t know if our abortion rate is low, it is way to much if you ask me. And here, abortion pressure is even more common than in the US, a friend of mine was almost forced into a late-term abortion, luckily she was 26 weeks. Another woman I know was yelled at by her doctor after she decided against abortion. It is cruel

          • PrincessJasmine4

            awful.

            But look at this way. It only took 10 born alive babies to change the law where you are
            In Canada, the count is 491 and counting. They are just left to die.. and no one has bothered to re open to abortion debate over there.
            Just another reason to dislike Canada.

          • Ingrid Heimark

            The law wasn’t changed, byut the gestationa. limits was clarified, and probably will a few babies be saved each year, as they aprooach this gestational limits alive, so that is good :) That is why I sometimes ask God to hide the precious lives till the motjer is past the gestational limit, then they get to live :)

            And yes, countries that allow a child to be born and die is inhuman, but the workers who did this in Norway are still in their jobs. That is why I would NEVER trust any abortion doctor, no matter if he does them only once a month, with ANY of my OB/GYN needs, ever

          • PrincessJasmine4
          • Ingrid Heimark

            Yes, this is good :) In fact, with our new government, primary physicians will get the right not to refer for abortions, thank God! We must appreciate everything that goes our way, and making sure abortion is not defined as a human right is imperative. There is a good reason why I boycotted the Amnesty fundraiser, abortion is the most severe and ongoing human rights violation there is.

          • PrincessJasmine4

            Oh that’s definitely good news!
            The problem with pro aborts is that they want to force people to accept their ways.
            They would force doctors to preform abortions out here if they could.

          • Ingrid Heimark

            They simply can’t stand that someone doesn’t agree with them, it is extremely childish actually

  • Elisabet

    I have actually seen Pictures where dead fetuses are used as art supplies. Like a photograph of Marie Stopes with fetal parts all over it. Undignified and disgusting. I’m not saying there are many of them, but there are some.

    • Basset_Hound

      Isn’t this the chick that was selling that crap on an arts and crafts web site?

  • Marauder

    “Products of conception” always strikes me as weird, because every single person is a product of conception. “Terminated pregnancy” is bizarre too, because every pregnancy terminates. (Every year, I celebrate the anniversary of when my mom’s pregnancy terminated. It’s called “my birthday.”)

    • PrincessJasmine4

      very good point.
      I’m going to have to use that now ;-)

    • Basset_Hound

      I remember the day quite well. It was in July of 91. I had gone into the hospital at 11 a.m. when my water broke. It was now close to 2 a.m. the next morning. I had been pushing for two hours and my son still hadn’t traveled far enough down my birth canal even to be easily captured by forceps. The OB said “we’re going to take you to surgery now and terminate this pregnancy”. At that point in time, they could have taken him out through my right ear, I was so anxious to get the ordeal over with

      • DianaG2

        Hey, my youngest was born in May of 91.

    • Adam Peters

      “Every year, I celebrate the anniversary of when my mom’s pregnancy terminated. It’s called ‘my birthday.'”

      Nice :)

  • Acyutananda

    “. . . using arguments such as bodily autonomy to argue in favor of legally killing those children. . . . We must now turn towards the task of convincing
    people that killing these people is never justified.”

    The classic bodily-autonomy argument was the 1971 “A Defense of Abortion.” For a discussion of the weaknesses in that article, see
    http://www.noterminationwithoutrepresentation.org/personhood/#comment-44

    — for example, “Thomson’s implication that the unfairness we intuitively feel is ascribable only to the use of another person’s body. I think that in reality, that intuition is ascribable more to the DEGREE of the kidnapped person’s sacrifice than to the exact nature of it. . . . Thomson nowhere admits to this sleight of hand of hers, or tries to fix this defect.”